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01-23-2010, 9:40 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07377x.jpg Just getting started.  This is a twin engine (650s) for the 1350cc Pushrod class (APS-PG-1350 which means unlimited frame design, one or two engines, partial streamlined, pushrod engine, on gasoline.)  Current record is a big number (176 MPH).. Heads are out getting CR750 valves and valve seats, along with max porting (to accept 40mm carbs, four of them).  Heads are getting modified Formula Atlantic valve springs and bronze guides (almost flush cut due to large port work. Cams are out getting ground by WebCam (10-11,000 RPM grind).  All water pump drives are removed; both engines will get cooling water from a single electric pump (normally used for automotive race engines).  I'm planning to use a single radiator, sideways in the fairing, and a sub-coolant tank on the return side. Engines will be joined by water-jet cut 3/8" cold rolled steel plate (primary drive side).  Front engine crankshaft will join to the rear crankshaft through a chain of 500 clutch basket gears (to reduce rotation speed).  Both engines (staggered crank timing) will drive throught a modified 500 clutch with 500 trans (to reduce output shaft RPM).  Final drive will be chain; same method as last years single engine bike (which will also run this year with major engine mods).  Rear crankshaft/flywheel will run 95% inertial coupling ratio, compared to front crank/flywheel assembly (the flywheels will be even smaller than I ran on the 500 last year). Pistons are in process at CP/Carillo (looking for about 13-13.5:1 compression).  Both engines will have starters, to handle this compression. Oil pumps are removed from both engines; I'll be using a 3-stage dry sump, external, because I need to keep the primary drive "spur gear" system from loading up and sucking the horsepower. As you can see in the photo, I'm attempting to build this bike with rear suspension.  Note that the rear frame you see, above the wheel, will be cut off and replaced....it's another old Katana I've cut up, for this project.  The engines need to move back a few more inches, and I may have to move the front end forward (currently the same wheelbase I ran last year).  The suspension (rear) is still a question mark, due to space limitations (basically, how far can a man reach for the handlebars). Improved streamlining will be fitted to the single engine bike, and the twin engine bike, thanks to some great work by AirTech. If there is interest, I'll add to this as time goes on, and perhaps show some of the MPS-PG-500 bike project that is getting started (this is a 3rd bike, for my best friend to ride).  The MPS bike uses normal engine orientation, and has a 500 primary drive with a 650 trans installed (which turned out to be easy).  It will have extreme streamlining, lowering, etc. to run against a 124 record.  M class allows custom body/tank etc. and up to 10% wheelbase stretch, but must use a similar to original engine layout (and no dual engines allowed). Another friend is also started on a P-PP-500 (Production bike- production pushrod engine- 500cc).  It is a "naked Silverwing" (1981) that has 650 primary drive, 500 trans, and all the engine mods we're doing to the other engines.  That bike will run against a 116 record.  It has to keep all stock appearance, but oany ut-of-sight engine mods are allowed.  We'll have to bore the stock carbs to 38mm and alter the slide ports to get full lift when we need it. An awful lot of work and 7 months left.  Cross you fingers for us! JimL    Report

01-23-2010, 9:43 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07376x.jpg Here's a side view of engine orientation.  I have to tilt the engines to get the gear spacing correct.  The dry sump pump will run from the center gear shaft (which will be between the two crankcases).  There will be no gears on the trans shafts in the front engine, and no clutch basket on that one. JimL    Report

01-23-2010, 9:57 PM Oldlonely Joined on 04-12-2009 Gold Coast, Australia. Posts 181 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project JimL1581, This looks awesome, please keep us updated with the photos and story of your build as I am sure that many here would be as facinated by this as I am. Oldlonely. 1978 CX500 Shadow. Black - Resto Project. 1979 CX500 Shadow. White - Daily Ride. 1979 CX500 Shadow. Blue - Parts Bike 1981 CX500 Custom. (Just a Pile of Parts) !! 1980 Suzuki GSX750. (Yes, another project) !! 1972 Suzuki RL250. Age: 46    Report

01-24-2010, 9:24 AM AmericancClassic Joined on 08-25-2009 Naples, FL Posts 297 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Looks like a cool build. Your last one was incredible. 1981 Honda gl500    Report

01-24-2010, 11:33 AM Spacetiger Joined on 05-16-2009 Chantilly, VA Posts 1,353 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project We cannot wait to see the engineering and bike build - keep us posted if you can. Just curious, why are you taking this approach [2 x 650 cx engines] to attaking the 1350 class? Seems like there would be less mass if you used a single 1300 engine... If possible, add small print on the bike for this web site. Its like we're with you out on the flats. Jerry 90 PC 800 (commuting steed) 82 GL500I (50+mpg, great bike) 66 BMW R 50/2 (No brakes/HP) 80 CX500C (Loved this bike) 74 CB360 (Fun; but too small) 79 CX500D (40,000+ mi in 3 years) 76 CB550 (step up from 200cc) 74 KZ200 (1st bike!)    Report

01-24-2010, 4:39 PM PWG in Lowgap NC Joined on 01-07-2008 Minutes from the Blue Ridge Parkway Posts 2,379 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Ditto 06 Suzuki S50 daily ride CX500c Honda Magna BC age 72    Report

01-24-2010, 8:00 PM RichNCT Joined on 03-02-2006 Connecticut, USA Posts 3,463 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project "If there is interest, I'll add to this as time goes on . . . "  Oh yeah!  Refueling on The James Bay Road, 2009 Born to be relatively wild (for a grampa x 3) GL650I, CX650E, CX650T    Report

01-24-2010, 8:44 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project No pics tonight, but if you look at the previous pic of the rear angle view (showing the rear suspension), this next will make sense. I made up some braces today and bolted the cases together with transmission installed and primary drives in place.  I'll soon have pics of the gear arrangement (got to tear down two more engines for more 500 parts).  An interesting note:  If you bolt a 500 trans into a 650 (to get closer gear ratios) you'll be surprised to find the crankshaft won't rotate!  There is an "oil control plate" on top of the 500 trans, but not on the 650.  After I took it off, the crank clears ok. So....with the engines bolted together for positioning, I noticed that the upper rear shock mount is welded to a cross-tube in the Suzuki frame.  If I cut the tube out, and turn it around (adding more frame to mount it), the rear cylinder head can tilt back under my seat position, and the front of the forward engine raises up another 1.5".  The front engine is now almost level, and the rear head will still drain oil down the return tube....good enough. At that engine position, I'll have about 2" front fork travel, while keeping the handlebars within reach.  May not sound like a big deal, but it's a step forward; I'll be bending tubing soon!  Regarding the question of "why two 650's".... it is because of the pushrod class rules.  The only other 1350cc pushrod engines are Harleys, Guzzis, BMW.  The pushrods do NOT compete against Hayabusas, etc.  None of the big twin pushrod engines have enough valve area/bore ratio to match the flow capacity of these modified GL heads.  Additionaly, they cannot run the high RPM without getting into very high piston speeds.  While it is true that high tech pistons and connecting rods will allow higher piston speeds than previously used, you still get into Mach number problems with intake tract airflow (airflow is directly tied to piston speed....when the piston speed becomes too high, the airflow tries to exceed Mach 0.5).  You cannot exceed Mach 0.5 in the intake tract...you literally hit a wall, partially due to air resonance harmonics (which can double wave speeds as molecules are driven back and forth against each other).  Our engines have very low piston speeds (meaning we can continue filling the cylinders at high RPM), and extreme porting and valve area increase helps keep airflow below the critical Mach number.  That is why I'm tuning for 10000-11000 RPM peak power this year . HP = torque x RPM divided by 5252.  Keep in mind that torque is a function of compression ratio and cylinder filling (not stroke length, as some believe).  If I can spin 3000-4000 RPM higher than a Harley 1350, and keep the engine together at 13:1 compression, there is significantly more HP available.  Cylinder filling is dependant on staying under that Mach number. I've rattled on long enough....more when I have some pics to show you. Thanks for the interest!    Report

01-24-2010, 9:03 PM Clumzi Joined on 01-26-2009 Olympia Washington Posts 636 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project I've had dreams about seeing a twin engine cx for a LONG time.  I've dreamt of a monster cx twin engine cruiser and have wanted to see what is possible.  I can't believe you are looking to have this thing ready for the salt in 7 months.  Kudos and good luck and this will be bookmarked on my machine when I get home.  And, as always, pictures pictures pictures. -nick 1979 CX Rat Sport (EMGO pods, wrapped MAC 2in1, 90/130 re-jet, 18" rear wheel, 50 cal ammo cans, Viper cafe faring, $.97 rattle can flat black) 1987 Toyota Van (Whitey) 2002 Subaru Legacy GT (Spiffy) Motorcycles should be black and dirty :)    Report

01-24-2010, 10:52 PM Panther Joined on 05-09-2006 Las Vegas, NV Posts 1,264 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Oh so IN for this one. Good to know about the 500 trans in a 650 case. Is it worth it to find a way to modify the oil control plate to clear the crank? I'll have to look close at the differences when i get into my ADV motor build. Oh, and Jim, I sent you a PM awhile back. Peace & Light >^..^< .......... '83 GL650swi "My Little Grey Lady" '82 GL500swi parts bike '78 DT175 '86 LS650 Milady's bike    Report

01-25-2010, 3:10 AM Steve F Joined on 06-25-2009 Sydney, Australia Posts 174 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Great build, I'm going to be keeping an eye on this one for sure Cheers Steve    Report

01-25-2010, 10:44 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07378x.jpg A little work tonight: Front forks established at 32 degrees rake, and 5.5" trail (7.1% wherein the target is 5-10% of wheelbase).  It looks like I can have about 2 1/2" travel, front and rear. I'm building the bike without tires, to "save" that 2 1/2" (which is how much I'll gain from the table, when the tires are mounted). Last years bike can be seen hanging from the ceiling....I'm still working in 10' x 18'.    Report

01-25-2010, 10:50 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07386x.jpg Here's a pic of the new gear train idea.  By using a crankshaft primary gear on each clutch basket, I can use a single clutch basket gear in the middle.  This method puts the gears in better position for support shafts and pressure fed oiling.  It also eliminates a lot of the case machining (there will still be some milled away, but considerably less).  Additionally, it stays away from milling and welding up an oil passage. The "center gear" shown is just a piece of foam board for size....my spare basket gear is out being scanned. The dry sump pump can run from the forward small idler, which spins at crank speed and in the right direction.  The dry sump pump needs to run at 1/3rd to 1/2 crankshaft speed....this arrangement leaves room for the cog belt pulley neede to get that number.    Report

01-25-2010, 10:54 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07381x.jpg And a pic of the rear cylinder position, demonstrating where I'll cut away structure and build new upper shock support "behind" the top of the shock. That's all for tonight....cams are done and ready to pick up.  Heads by the weekend, then pistons made up.  I'll get the blocks bored before milling the cases; if the bore gets screwed up, the engine is gone....if the milling is bad, we can weld up and recut.  I have one spare block. Thanks for the interest and kind comments.  This project is a little overwhelming, at times, but I have to try it!    Report

01-25-2010, 11:13 PM DavidfromWisconsin Joined on 03-19-2008 Appleton, WI Posts 2,458 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Jim, You have talked about "Both engines (staggered crank timing) will drive throught a modified 500 clutch with 500 trans (to reduce output shaft RPM)" I know for a fact that the 650 primary and clutch with the 650 transmission will give you a higher speed for the same RPM. Yet in another posting you say, "An interesting note:  If you bolt a 500 trans into a 650 (to get closer gear ratios) you'll be surprised to find the crankshaft won't rotate!" I am confused, are you looking for power or speed? I can understand the need for both, but I am somewhat confused. Also the 650 does have an oil splash guard in front of the transmission, behind the clutch assembly, but it is shaped differently than the 500 unit. OIL SEPARATOR part #11365-ME2-000 Also something you might consider is that the 500 clutch assembly has weaker springs and therefore is more prone to slipping than the 650 unit. So, if you are using the 500 unit you might want to use the 650 springs with it to prevent slippage with the horsepower you are probably going to be making with your modifications. The bike looks awesome and I wish you nothing but the best on the project. Please do keep us up on how the project progresses. David From Wisconsin ... R80Dave '82 GL500I alias Candy '82 GL500I alias Candy II '00 BMW K1200LT & trailer '81 KZ440 (Wife's learning bike)    Report

01-26-2010, 8:18 AM AmericancClassic Joined on 08-25-2009 Naples, FL Posts 297 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project  DavidfromWisconsin wrote: Jim, You have talked about "Both engines (staggered crank timing) will drive throught a modified 500 clutch with 500 trans (to reduce output shaft RPM)" I know for a fact that the 650 primary and clutch with the 650 transmission will give you a higher speed for the same RPM. Yet in another posting you say, "An interesting note:  If you bolt a 500 trans into a 650 (to get closer gear ratios) you'll be surprised to find the crankshaft won't rotate!" I am confused, are you looking for power or speed? I can understand the need for both, but I am somewhat confused. My assumption is he wants a lower gear ratio coming out of the trans, since he can easily change the gear ratios with the chain drive. 1981 Honda gl500    Report

01-26-2010, 6:47 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Absolutely correct....I need the output shaft speed below 5000 RPM, because the countershaft sprocket must be 17 or 18 tooth to reduce chain angle-over under load.  We've learned that chains won't go 5 miles at super high speed if either sprocket is too small.  Also, the oil plate I'm talking about is on top of the gear set, not behind the clutch. Bad news about the gear drive between cranks.  I'll have to go external Gilmer belt.  Talked to a great engineer who's been down the gear path; very bad territory for a novice like me!! More to come....you get to see the screw-ups first hand!    Report

01-26-2010, 8:35 PM DavidfromWisconsin Joined on 03-19-2008 Appleton, WI Posts 2,458 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project I love seeing it all and cheering you on ... The good, the bad and the ugly!!! We learn from it all. Please keep it coming ... David From Wisconsin ... R80Dave '82 GL500I alias Candy '82 GL500I alias Candy II '00 BMW K1200LT & trailer '81 KZ440 (Wife's learning bike)    Report

01-26-2010, 9:31 PM lucky Joined on 03-06-2009 kingman az age 26 Posts 1,443 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project i think we all demand pics!!!! but keep up the good work and lots of luck to you at the race's 1982 honda cx500c 1979 honda xr185 dirt bike If you can read this thank a TEACHER If you're reading this in ENGLISH thank a SOLDIER http://globalcxglvtwins.hostingdelivered.com/    Report

01-27-2010, 6:34 PM ScottInIowa Joined on 10-30-2007 Posts 170 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Tell us more about the 500 P-PP bike too. I so wanted to build a bike to try to get the 116.004 record from that Buell. But, time and money limited, so go get em! Staying shaft drive on that one? Are you building that one too? I've got some CX parts and would love to help any way I can. Please contact me off-list and I'll see what I can do to help. '78 CX500 frame/79ish CX500 engine    Report

01-27-2010, 10:14 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07295.JPG The Production Pushrod bike is a "naked" Silverwing, not a CX, for a couple of reasons.  #1:  The turn signals are external mounted (not faired in as on the CX) and are allowed to be removed because of this design. #2  The seat is set a little lower in the bike (remember...no visible mods allowed). #3  The handlebars can be changed to clubmans if they mount in the stock brackes (also true of the CX)... good for this model. #4  The air suspension Pro-Link has the lowest published ground clearance (unloaded), which the bike must meet.  If it squats low with the rider, that's ok (low air pressure). Unseen power mods are allowed, so the bike will be (internally) identical to my new 500 engine (big valves, ported, ultra-high compression, radical cam, superlight flywheel, GL650 primary drive, and power up to 11,000 RPM).  The carbs will be stock units, bored out (legal), and the stock exhaust will be split (full length) to remove the inner tube (it's double walled), then welded back up and refinished (also legal).  We may hide an electric water pump, out of view, if it is acceptable to the inspectors.  Otherwise it will use a stock water pump.  The rules specifically say, "modifications must be out of sight"....so I think the bottom side of the gas tank could be cut away to leave room for an electric pump.  One of our small problems is finding the plastic Silver Wing emblem on one of our side covers....we have to keep all original emblems (though the paint doesn't have to be stock).  I have the side covers, just the raised letter emblem fell off of one...... always something.... This bike will also be constant loss electrical, to get rid of the magnet drag on the crankshaft (a big power eater). As you can see, the twin shock CX is not the right bike for Production class (too tall and might have to argue about removing the turn signals).  The Buell Blast had a very small frontal area, which helped.  We'll do our best to get all these bikes built (the twin engine bike is eating time and money at an incredible rate!) Here's a pic of the MPS-PG-500 bike the day I brought it to the shop (using a CX because M class allows solid rear end, lowered, and front end mods to accept extreme streamling).    Report

01-29-2010, 10:14 AM Abes_CW Joined on 04-17-2007 saskatoon Posts 3,036 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Jim, I have a couple spare Silverwing sidecover badges I could donate to the cause, intact but tabs broken. 1983 GL650i Had 4 CX/GL's at one point this year, down to one, next spring is another adventure! age 38 (29 plus tax)    Report

01-29-2010, 3:19 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project That would make things simpler.  Email me with an address so I can pay the mail costs. leinfam@earthlink.net thanks, JimL    Report

01-29-2010, 3:43 PM Abes_CW Joined on 04-17-2007 saskatoon Posts 3,036 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project will zap you tonight 1983 GL650i Had 4 CX/GL's at one point this year, down to one, next spring is another adventure! age 38 (29 plus tax)    Report

01-29-2010, 3:48 PM wildmanwill Joined on 05-25-2008 Chester County, Pennsylvania Posts 4,034 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Hey Jim you may want to break up your email address so that it is not harvested for spam.  Some of the guys will put  AT where the @ symbol goes, etc. So it may look like  yourname AT yahoo DOT com  for example 1983 CX650 Turbo 1982 CX500 Custom Donating Member    Report

01-29-2010, 10:06 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Ok...thanks.....have had really good service with Earthlink spamblocker, also.  Couldn't live without it.... worth the price.    Report

01-31-2010, 10:41 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07400xx.jpg Spent 2 days hand carving the 3/8" steel plate for the primary connection.  It's backed with 1" square "tool steel" bar stock....still a little welding to finish before I start on covers, bearing carriers for the drive pulleys, etc.  This photo shows how the Gilmer belt will run (probably 3" or 4" pulleys, which will keep the belt surface speed below 60-70 MPH at 11,000 RPM). I've raised the front of the engine some more, to get a little more front tire clearance.  More below....    Report

01-31-2010, 10:44 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07406x.jpg Here's a pic of the front quarter view, showing how I've raised the engine to clear the front tire (I'm using a piece of a tire for checking....easier than the whole tire). The Katana frame will get cut away considerably, before I start grafting on tubing.  I'm thinking I'll build it so the engines come out the front of the frame, after the wheel and fork tubes are removed. Time will tell....more below.    Report

01-31-2010, 10:48 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07403x.jpg This pic shows my smallest flywheel and my biggest countershaft sprocket (18T).  I made a little more room, compared to the 500 last year.  The swing arm pivot was touchy, because the rear sprocket will only have 30 or 31 teeth.  Rear wheel travel will be limited to about 2 inches. more below.....    Report

01-31-2010, 10:50 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07402x.jpg Here's a view looking down the chain run, from the rear sprocket area.  You can barely see the flywheel, above and ahead of the sprocket..... more below...    Report

01-31-2010, 10:53 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07401x.jpg One more look at the motor plate.  This view is a little better, to get a feel for how heavy that plate is!  When I started, it was about as big a piece of metal as I could handle (it was 4 feet long, 1 foot wide, and 3/8" thick).  It was "smashed fingers just lookin' for a place to happen".  Much easier now (only 31" long). JimL    Report

02-13-2010, 8:58 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07414x.jpg I've now fitted a Yamaha FZR1000 front end (fits the Suzuki frame head with help of .125" spacer under the bottom bearing).  These forks will be safer, and give me a little more trail.  I had to move the engines back 1" and down in front by 3/4".  The FZR forks are much bigger than the Katana, and the tubes are closer to the stem line.  I couldn't turn without hitting the forward valve cover. The top tube will be bent something like the pic below, from 1 5/8" tubing (.125" wall), with my 7" radius die.  The bottom tubes are going to require a radical approach, in order to get the engines in and out, and to clear the forward-most carburetor. Some of my heads are finally at CP getting measured for piston crowns (looking for 13:1 ratio).  The new sprocket drive coupler is in process. busy project.....and filled with one challenge after another! JimL    Report

02-13-2010, 9:00 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07410x.jpg Here's a look at the FZR front end and wheel.    Report

02-14-2010, 2:15 AM BearCX Joined on 03-11-2008 Roseworthy, Sth Aust Posts 525 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Man you spin me out. You just jump in with both feet.  If only I was so brave, your work inspires me to try more stuff for myself. 13:1 pistons ?? Hmmmm.......might have to get me some of them. Could always find some NitroMeth. If you're still in control...You're not going fast enough.    Report

02-14-2010, 8:11 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07416x.jpg Work done today (photos will be in sequential posts): 1.  This shows my plumb bob, hung through the center of the steering stem.  The tie rod (seen behind the wheel) is used to fine adjust vertical true, after the table is trued and blocked, when measuring.  You can also see where the front wheel is bolted throught the table frame (table frame length was set to match desired wheel base). 2.  Photo shows top tubes fitting method.  The plumb bob and level can be seen.  This is 6.5" radius bend in my 1 5/8" top tubes. 3.  The ends of the top tubes were notched to fit the cut Katana frame.  These will make some pretty tight welds after the paint is ground away. 4.  Here's the fairing from last years 500cc pushrod bike, fitted around the twin engines.  I designed this frame to use EXACTLY the same front and side fairing mounts as last years bike.  It will save me some time and effort as I work through this, and I already know my legs and arms fit the 500cc bike.  I'm considering adding 1" of seat height (compared to my 500cc bike) to allow a little more room under my right foot for the 4 megaphones.    Report

02-14-2010, 8:13 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07418x.jpg 2.  Top tube fitting method.    Report

02-14-2010, 8:14 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07417x.jpg 3.  Weld joint fit up.    Report

02-14-2010, 8:16 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07423x.jpg 4.  Last years fairing positioned.  Note the spiffy blue paper towel upholstery on the wood block seat! A really good day in the shop.    Report

02-14-2010, 8:18 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07421x.jpg ...and one last pic for tonight.... a view inside the fairing.  The front down tubes will be "strange" and will use quite a bit of the forward space in each side of the fairing, because of the forward carb on the forward head.    Report

02-14-2010, 9:16 PM Silverado 6x6 Joined on 08-13-2009 Wasilla, Alaska Posts 440 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Jim this is awesome, please keep posting, you may not realize the magic you are doing or the inspiration for others. 1980 CX 500 Deluxe with Vetter Vindicator Electric Fan conversion LED lamp conversion Bridgestone Spitfires New Ricks Motorsports stator H4 HID headlamp 2009 Yamaha V-Star 1300 Tourer New stuff being added every day.    Report

02-20-2010, 5:35 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07424x.jpg Lower frame tubes are welded in, and rear mounts are in place for the motor plate.  The engines will have to be assembled to the motor plate, rather than installing as a unit.  It is too heavy and awkward to handle the whole unit, even with a helper. There will be an additional horizontal bar above the motor plate, which will have mounts for the engine blocks.  More gussets are coming for the rear of the top tubes, along with various other corners.  At this point the front and rear wheels, and motor plate, are within .020" of dead straight....which is as close as I can measure over 6 feet of reach. Regards, JimL    Report

02-21-2010, 8:48 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07428.JPG Motor mounts are in place, headstock area of frame is reinforced, as is the rear of the top tubes.  Working on the drive connection plates and oil pump arrangement. As you can see, the center tube got interesting, what with needing to clear all four exhaust.  That tube has thick wall tubes welded to the tabs, which allows me to slide the engines into place easily, and then run in the 6mm plate mount bolts.  Time to start cutting some 1/4" plate for the first level of drive support material. JimL    Report

02-24-2010, 10:45 AM RichNCT Joined on 03-02-2006 Connecticut, USA Posts 3,463 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Thanks for going to the extra effort of showing and explaining your projects to us Jim.  A bunch of us are looking forward to each new update!  Refueling on The James Bay Road, 2009 Born to be relatively wild (for a grampa x 3) GL650I, CX650E, CX650T    Report

02-24-2010, 12:07 PM AmericancClassic Joined on 08-25-2009 Naples, FL Posts 297 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project  RichNCT wrote:   A bunch of us are looking forward to each new update!  Very much so. I wish I could add something valuable to this thread, but this is all WAY over my head. 1981 Honda gl500    Report

02-24-2010, 2:05 PM Clumzi Joined on 01-26-2009 Olympia Washington Posts 636 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project this is the main reason I check in on the forum these days, to see how this projects is coming along. 1979 CX Rat Sport (EMGO pods, wrapped MAC 2in1, 90/130 re-jet, 18" rear wheel, 50 cal ammo cans, Viper cafe faring, $.97 rattle can flat black) 1987 Toyota Van (Whitey) 2002 Subaru Legacy GT (Spiffy) Motorcycles should be black and dirty :)    Report

02-24-2010, 11:03 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07433.JPG Below is a photo of a 650 head with the larger valve seats installed.  This the largest we could go, because of availability of valves (using Kibblewite parts, designed for modifying CR450F engines).  GL500 actually has larger valves than the 650, but the stems are too short.  My 500 heads are getting smaller diameter valve stem size (5.5 instead of 6.5mm) in order to improve flow....there is no room for larger seats in the 500 heads.    Report

02-24-2010, 11:05 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07435.JPG Here's a comparison of intake valves, with the old 650 intake valve sitting on top of my KPI valve.  You can see it is quite a bit bigger.    Report

02-24-2010, 11:11 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07431.JPG Here's an old head (left) and a freshened head (right).  The intake port is now 40mm, which is more than enough for this size engine.  We'll actually run the same size on my 500 heads, but the 500 can spin higher.  We are using titanium keepers on all of the heads, and valve springs similar to Formula Atlantic parts.  We found a LOT of valve float damage on all 3 of the 650 cams that I pulled out (pitted areas, just past the top of the lobes....caused by the lifters slamming back down like little jackhammers)  The 500s cams seem a little better, probably because of the shorter pushrods (less weight).  Our new valves for the 500s are much lighter than original...I need the RPM to reach my target.      Report

02-24-2010, 11:15 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07434.JPG A fuzzy pic, but here's the old 650 valves, next to the new ones....just to give you an idea of the size difference. Intakes compared, on left, exhausts on right. Thanks for following along, it's still being fun, so far! JimL    Report

03-07-2010, 9:27 PM JimL1581 Joined on 04-19-2009 Posts 176 Re: Another Salt Flats Silver Wing project Attachment: DSC07451x.jpg A lot working, but not much to show, yet.  Just for fun, here's a comparison of rear sprocket from last years single engine 500, to this years twin-engine 650 (1350). Last  years bike ran an 17 tooth countershaft, Silverwing2 will run an 18 tooth counter and rear gears from 30T (as shown) up to 34T. The project is dragging waiting for heads, pistons, drive coupling parts, fiberglass (which I need before I can continue on the rear frame section).  Typical problems in the middle of any build; sure hard on the wallet and the attitude! Thanks for following along.  Also....can someone tell me how to get more than one pic in each post? Thanks!  JimL    Report

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