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02-25-2010, 6:43 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Hello. i took apart my motor about 10 years ago to replace the cam chain tensioner. The bike has not run since then. Last summer i cleaned out the carbs and I can still not get it to run. It does crank over quite well, but will not fire. I was wondering if it was possible that I might have installed the pulse generator 180 degrees off? This might be why it wont fire. I only have 22 thousand klics on it. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

02-25-2010, 6:45 PM Blindstitch Joined on 03-14-2009 Greenfield Wisconsin Posts 9,844 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Well it is possible on the gl500 and gl650's  so I bet it is possible. 1979 CX500 Supertanker ATGATT makes riding a bike like a sled easier. Quick Reference    Report

02-25-2010, 10:27 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks Blindstich. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

02-26-2010, 9:41 AM wildmanwill Joined on 05-25-2008 Chester County, Pennsylvania Posts 4,034 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? yeah, its pretty much the same engine in the E, so its worth looking into as a possibility. Don't forget to set up your profile with your location and bike info please http://choppercharles.com/cs/forums/93116/ShowPost.aspx#93116 1983 CX650 Turbo 1982 CX500 Custom Donating Member    Report

02-26-2010, 10:25 AM Sams GL 650 Joined on 02-17-2010 Annville PA (USA) Posts 191 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? With only 22,000 on it, there should still be plenty of life left in that engine and parts. If its been 10 years since attending to, just be methodical in your approach. I find the Haynes manual particularly helpful in these restorations. Keep us posted,---many knowledgeablehelpful members here. sam Bikes: 2002 Kawasaki Vulcan 1983 Honda GL 650 1 st Bike Honda CL 175 (1974) Age 52    Report

02-26-2010, 11:08 AM Eurovee. Joined on 12-29-2006 Euroland Posts 513 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? It`s possible if the actual  `cam`-shaped rotor (the centre part with the `tit` on it) of the ATU was removed that it was put back on 180 deg off. Assuming its OK did you remember to locate the peg in the correct cut-out; Are the fuel tap hoses connected correctly; Have you checked for a spark by resting a plug on one of the valve cover bolts or other engine earth point? If not check you have battery voltage at the black/white wires on each coil and ignition spark unit with ignition and run switch to `run`. The carbs will have to be 100% clean - especially the pilot circuit. Ten years inactive gives plenty of time for old fuel to block tiny carburetor passages,even cleaning them `last year` might not leave them in running condition.. CX650 Eurosprout CX500 Eurospurt GL650 Silverthing CX/GL 500 CX-periment 24 years and 140,000 miles a CXian...    Report

02-26-2010, 8:48 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks guys, and thanks Eurovee for the picture. It has been so long since I had the motor out that I don't remember if I messed up or not.. Will have to look at it this week. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

02-26-2010, 9:32 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Hey Windmillman. I have tried several times to update my profile but it just never shows up om my posts. I have even used a resized picture of my Cx and nothing shows up. Ken 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

02-26-2010, 9:51 PM timk Joined on 02-26-2008 Hubbard Oregon Posts 519 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Internet explorer doesn't work with posting pics. Firefox does though. I was wondering if refreshing your page would work with your update. think someone else had that problem before. Couple GL's and CX650 ... everythings in work....    Report

03-01-2010, 9:38 AM wildmanwill Joined on 05-25-2008 Chester County, Pennsylvania Posts 4,034 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Hi Ken, Looks like your location and bike info. worked, but yeah some people do have issues with the photo portion.  Sometimes it is due ot the image size of the photo you are trying to upload.  No worries, we'll stay on track with your bike problems and work on resolving them first.  1983 CX650 Turbo 1982 CX500 Custom Donating Member    Report

03-01-2010, 10:28 AM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Hi Wildmanwill. I tried several times to upload a picture. I have used an image resizer to resize them first.I have posted pics on another site with success, so I figures I would have no problem. I hate going the Photobucket route, as I have met with no success in the past. Wii have to try again. Thanks ...Ken 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-01-2010, 3:49 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? <BLOCKQUOTE><table width="85%"><tr><td class="txt4"><img src="/cs/Themes/default/images/icon-quote.gif">&nbsp;<strong>wildmanwill wrote:</strong></td></tr><tr><td class="quoteTable"><table width="100%"><tr><td width="100%" valign="top" class="txt4">yeah, its pretty much the same engine in the E, so its worth looking into as a possibility.<br><br>Don't forget to set up your profile with your location and bike info please<br><br><a HREF="/cs/forums/93116/ShowPost.aspx#93116">http://choppercharles.com/cs/forums/93116/ShowPost.aspx#93116</a><br></td></tr></table></td></tr></table></BLOCKQUOTE>Thanks Sam. I can use all the help I get and appreciate it all too. Ken 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-02-2010, 11:40 AM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? <BLOCKQUOTE><table width="85%"><tr><td class="txt4"><img src="/cs/Themes/default/images/icon-quote.gif">&nbsp;<strong>Eurovee. wrote:</strong></td></tr><tr><td class="quoteTable"><table width="100%"><tr><td width="100%" valign="top" class="txt4">It`s possible if the actual  `cam`-shaped rotor (the centre part with the `tit` on it) of the ATU was removed that it was put back on 180 deg off.<br>Assuming its OK did you remember to locate the peg in the correct cut-out;<br><br><img src="http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/esox/Engines%20and%20parts%20etc/P2050001.jpg" border="0" /><br><br>Are the fuel tap hoses connected correctly;<br><br><img src="http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/esox/Engines%20and%20parts%20etc/P5070042.jpg" border="0" /><br><br>Have you checked for a spark by resting a plug on one of the valve cover bolts or other engine earth point?<br><br>If not check you have battery voltage at the black/white wires on each coil and ignition spark unit with ignition and run switch to `run`.<br><br>The carbs will have to be 100% clean - especially the pilot circuit.<br>Ten years inactive gives plenty of time for old fuel to block tiny carburetor passages,even cleaning them `last year` might not leave them in running condition..<br><br><br><br></td></tr></table></td></tr></table></BLOCKQUOTE>Eurovee. I don't have the fuel tap hooked up for my bike. i have and external fuel supply hooked up to the carbs. My fuel tap was stolen many years ago and I am still trying to find a replacement. I might go for one off of an ATC and disable the vacuum on the carbs. I found one on Ebay for less then $20.00. I am going over to check all my electrical connections later today, but I suspect I am going to have to pull the motor and check the Pulse Generator. It does not really take too long to pull the motor out.Cheers Ken. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-02-2010, 12:12 PM wildmanwill Joined on 05-25-2008 Chester County, Pennsylvania Posts 4,034 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Internet explorer doesn't handle the quoting too well either.  Most of us here use Firefox for the forum posts to work properly. 1983 CX650 Turbo 1982 CX500 Custom Donating Member    Report

03-02-2010, 4:08 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? I will see what I can do. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-02-2010, 5:19 PM Blindstitch Joined on 03-14-2009 Greenfield Wisconsin Posts 9,844 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem?  quicksilver wrote:  Eurovee. wrote: It`s possible if the actual  `cam`-shaped rotor (the centre part with the `tit` on it) of the ATU was removed that it was put back on 180 deg off. Assuming its OK did you remember to locate the peg in the correct cut-out; Are the fuel tap hoses connected correctly; Have you checked for a spark by resting a plug on one of the valve cover bolts or other engine earth point? If not check you have battery voltage at the black/white wires on each coil and ignition spark unit with ignition and run switch to `run`. The carbs will have to be 100% clean - especially the pilot circuit. Ten years inactive gives plenty of time for old fuel to block tiny carburetor passages,even cleaning them `last year` might not leave them in running condition.. Eurovee. I don't have the fuel tap hooked up for my bike. i have and external fuel supply hooked up to the carbs. My fuel tap was stolen many years ago and I am still trying to find a replacement. I might go for one off of an ATC and disable the vacuum on the carbs. I found one on Ebay for less then $20.00. I am going over to check all my electrical connections later today, but I suspect I am going to have to pull the motor and check the Pulse Generator. It does not really take too long to pull the motor out.Cheers Ken. 1979 CX500 Supertanker ATGATT makes riding a bike like a sled easier. Quick Reference    Report

03-07-2010, 4:01 PM Sidecar Bob Joined on 03-02-2006 Kawartha Lakes, Ontario Posts 1,899 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem?  quicksilver wrote: My fuel tap was stolen many years ago and I am still trying to find a replacement. I might go for one off of an ATC and disable the vacuum on the carbs. I found one on Ebay for less then $20.00. Some people selling petcocks on eBay give the size across the flats of the nut, not the size of the threads so make sure you contact them and ask before you buy. Mr. Honda ('83 GL1000/Dnepr) summer The Famous Eccles ('84 GX650EI/Velorex700) winter WHY I HAVEN"T BEEN AROUND MUCH LATELY    Report

03-07-2010, 4:08 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks for the reply. Sidecar Bob. i just got an email from an Ebay seller in vancouve who happens to have a petcock for my particular bike, but says it comes from a non running bike. I imagine I should still be able to get the rubbers for it from Honda, if not. Or I could by pass the vacuum. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-07-2010, 5:22 PM Sidecar Bob Joined on 03-02-2006 Kawartha Lakes, Ontario Posts 1,899 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? The rubber disc with 4 holes that forms the valve is not available. I have bought a couple of Suzuki ones that I think I can make work, but I am not able to try it because I am recovering from surgery on my hand. http://choppercharles.com/cs/forums/168619/ShowPost.aspx The last time I checked the rubber parts for the vacuum were still available as a kit from Honda. Mr. Honda ('83 GL1000/Dnepr) summer The Famous Eccles ('84 GX650EI/Velorex700) winter WHY I HAVEN"T BEEN AROUND MUCH LATELY    Report

03-08-2010, 5:34 PM roundman72 Joined on 03-24-2009 Laporte Indiana Posts 393 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? i had the same problem and my bike sat for years too fed up with no spark.  thanks to this site and a heart attack i found a green wire under the coils that grounds to the frame.  that was the only thing that was wrong.  bike sat for i am guessing 6 years beacuse of that! 82 gl500I 82 xs650 70 cl450 (restoring) 74 cl450 (non runner) 00 Moto Guzzi Jackal (ended up selling)    Report

03-08-2010, 6:45 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks Roundman. That just gives me somewhere else to look in my quest to track down why it won't start. Going to check all grounds and connectors beforI pull the motor ahead to check the pulse generator. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-09-2010, 3:33 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Well, I was over working on my bike today. i found that there were a couple of ground wires that has rusty connections. I also undid the coils from their mounts and cleaned up the contacts. I pulled out the plugs and found that I have a good spark on both sides. My question is before I pull the moter, is would I have a good spark if the pulse generator was 180 degrees off? i suspect it would. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-09-2010, 3:45 PM DaveF Joined on 06-11-2008 Lawrenceville, GA Posts 1,232 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Yes, you would have good spark if the pulse generator was off 180 degrees.  Only the timing would be off. Timing... hmmm, it might be a good idea to check the timing with a timing light before you pull the motor. My Web Site 1982 GL500 1983 GL650    Report

03-09-2010, 3:52 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks DaveF. So I guess I can check it while it is cranking over then. It cranks but does not fire up at this point. Ken 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-09-2010, 4:09 PM DaveF Joined on 06-11-2008 Lawrenceville, GA Posts 1,232 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Yes, you can at least tell if it is grossly out of time while cranking it.  If it is anywhere near correct the timing advancer mechanism is installed properly.  If it's way out of time you know what's next. My Web Site 1982 GL500 1983 GL650    Report

03-09-2010, 4:44 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks once again Dave. I just printed up some pics off of my repair manual disc of the pulse generator so at least i will know how to align it properly. As I remember, it does not really take all to long to remove the motor or at least slide it forward enough to get at the pulse generator cover. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-09-2010, 4:51 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? By the way Dave. I just veiwed your home page. Great work. It is really informative. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-09-2010, 5:30 PM DaveF Joined on 06-11-2008 Lawrenceville, GA Posts 1,232 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thank you, Ken. Additional timing information can be found here.  As described in that thread, not only can the timing be 180 out if the advancer mechanism is installed incorrectly, it can also be 180 out if the mechanism came apart during handling.  This happens fairly often but will be caught if the static timing checks are made as described in the shop manual. My Web Site 1982 GL500 1983 GL650    Report

03-09-2010, 7:52 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks again Dave. That link you posted had some good pictures og the pulse generator. To say that I was clueless when I took the back off of my motor would be an understatement. I took it off and it sat for quite a long time until I replaced the cam chain tensioner. I will check the timing first, but I'm almost certain I goofed the first time. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-11-2010, 12:11 PM slipchuck Joined on 04-26-2007 canada Posts 309 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? don't forget about the pulser gap. also, check to see if there are any cracks/gaps between your cylinder and the airbox. the gas will not be able to "vapourise" making it very hard if not impossible to start (I know this from experence :) good luck randy Save a child with cancer! http://www.csolve.net/~randyroi    Report

03-11-2010, 12:34 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks Randy. Will look into that also. Ken 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-17-2010, 2:26 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Well, i have since dropped the motor out of my bike to find that the pulse geneator and rotor were installed properly. i am next going to check for TDC on both cylinders and see if the rotor lines up to the pickups where it should. When I was taking the motor out, I forfot to unclip the wires coming out by the pulse generator so i had to cut them because I could not back the motor up enough on my own to undo it. i noticed there was 2 blue wires and I think 2 pink or white ones. Getting old, can not remember. I did mark these with a knife si I will be able to solder them back up. I have the carbs apart again and am cleaning those out. Hopefully next week, when I have more time I will be able to reinstall the motor and carbs. Fuuniest thing though. The bike has been sitting outside for a couple of years under a tarp. I guess I forgot to cover the ends of the mufflers and I found the Hbox full of water. I wonder if this caused excessive back pressure and caused it to not start? I feel like an idiot at this point. Any insight form other members whould be appreciated. Cheers...Ken 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-17-2010, 2:41 PM Sidecar Bob Joined on 03-02-2006 Kawartha Lakes, Ontario Posts 1,899 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Drill an 1/8" hole in the lowest point in the box to let it drain. It might not solve your problem but it will reduce the likelihood of it rusting out from the inside. Mr. Honda ('83 GL1000/Dnepr) summer The Famous Eccles ('84 GX650EI/Velorex700) winter WHY I HAVEN"T BEEN AROUND MUCH LATELY    Report

03-17-2010, 2:46 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks Bob. I had thougt of doing that and running a little Muriatic acid through it just to clean it up a bit. There was a lot of water in there that is why I thought that maybe this caused too much back pressure. Ken 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-17-2010, 4:46 PM Sidecar Bob Joined on 03-02-2006 Kawartha Lakes, Ontario Posts 1,899 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? I would steer clear of muriatic if at all possible. It will only make it rust worse if you don't get it all out. I found a half pint bottle of it that my dad had and sat it on the workbench so I would find a better storage place for it. When I came back a couple of days later everything within a foot and a half was rusty. Glass bottle with metal lid, screwed on securely and I hadn't opened it. Imagine what a few drops inside an already rusty box could do... What you might consider is phosphoric acid. It will turn red rust to black rust, preventing further corrosion. Mr. Honda ('83 GL1000/Dnepr) summer The Famous Eccles ('84 GX650EI/Velorex700) winter WHY I HAVEN"T BEEN AROUND MUCH LATELY    Report

03-17-2010, 4:51 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks Bob. That sounds like a better altrenative. 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-19-2010, 11:47 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Hello all. Today I went and checked the timing on my Cx650 while the motor was still out. I cracked it over using a wrench on the front of the motor until the right piston was top dead centre. I lined up the markings on the fly wheel through the inspection hole on the right side. I saw FS II F1 and the rotor on the pulse unit was lined up with the marking on the right side. i don't know off hand what the gap is supposed to be. I did not have my feeler gauges with me. I used the brake feeler gauge that come with the tool kit. it reads 0.7. I had a little wiggle room. I would say off hand the it measured 1.0. Anyway everything looks like it is where it should be. Ken 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-20-2010, 1:18 AM DaveF Joined on 06-11-2008 Lawrenceville, GA Posts 1,232 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? If I'm understanding this correctly, the timing is not correct.  The rotor should not be aligned with a marking on the plate, it should be aligned with one of the pickup coil nubs. From the other thread: The Honda shop manual procedure calls for the pickup coil timing to be checked twice, once when the crankshaft is set to "FS" on the left side and once when set to "FS" on the right side.  When this is done, the nub on the rotor should align with the nub on the applicable pickup coil. If the timing advance assembly is out 180 degrees, the nubs will not even be close in timing. According to the factory shop manual the gap is supposed to be 0.45 - 0.65 mm, or 0.018 - 0.026 inches. My Web Site 1982 GL500 1983 GL650    Report

03-20-2010, 6:13 AM Sidecar Bob Joined on 03-02-2006 Kawartha Lakes, Ontario Posts 1,899 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? If you have it apart far enough to look at the timing, why not remove three more screws and make sure the timing unit is on right. BTW: The 0.7mm feeler is for measuring the gap between the brake caliper and the rotor when you put the wheel in. BTW: You should never use a feeler made from a magnetic metal for the pulser gap. You need a brass feeler for this. BTW: Honda says to test the ignition system by touching a screwdriver to the nub on the pulser coil and watching for a spark at the plug. If you get a good spark all the electrical parts are OK.   Mr. Honda ('83 GL1000/Dnepr) summer The Famous Eccles ('84 GX650EI/Velorex700) winter WHY I HAVEN"T BEEN AROUND MUCH LATELY    Report

03-20-2010, 9:43 AM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Thanks for the reply dave. My rotor lines up with the nub just as in your picture. I was tired when i wrote this after work last night. My only concern was how much of aa air gap should there be between the rotor and the nub? Thanks ...Ken 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

03-20-2010, 11:06 PM quicksilver Joined on 02-25-2010 BC. Canada Posts 35 Re: CX650E Pulse generator Problem? Update. found the gap measurements in my Repair manual CD. Sorry if i sound dense at times. too much going on right now. Wiil be checking the gap tomorrow morning, weather permitting. My bike is sitting outside, coverd up at present. I appreciate all the help and suggestions I have gotten. Thanks...Ken 1983 Honda CX650E Eurosport A work in progress    Report

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