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Technical Help Forum
Started by dang84119 at 02-25-2009 10:28 PM. Topic has 25 replies.
  
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 02-25-2009, 10:28 PM
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dang84119
Joined on 02-22-2009
Herriman, UT
Posts 182
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WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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Looks like I'm going to have to replace the mechanical seal on a 79 cx500c and I want to do it with the engine in the frame "Sheps method" Any advice? Also where to find cheaper seals and gaskets than at mrcycles.com They want 47.00 for the mech. seals alone plus shipping
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
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02-25-2009, 11:22 PM
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Sture (in Sweden)
 
Joined on 03-13-2006
Lund, SWEDEN, born -41
Posts 911
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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There is a Yamaha seal that many of us are using. I´ve had three or four of those Yamaha seals pressed in, myself. I´m talking of the original method, which involves an engine pull. The seal is for XZ 550 Vision - don´t have the parts No in my head.
In Sweden a Yamaha seal would cost about half to a third of the Honda seal. They are almost totally identical - all dimensions (talking 1/100 mm).
There also is a cheap irrigation water pump seal (Davey, AUS) that fits perfectly. They cost something like $ 9, if memory serves. I bought 10 of those from AUS, via a French CX-er. They are absolutely perfect and I have three in, by now. Have sold a couple and keeping the rest for future needs. Maybe you can get some via the AUS CX site?
There is nothing special with these seals, you can find them in (Chinese / Oriental) pump seal manufacturers export catalogs. It´s only that Honda obviously decided to get rich on these...
Regards
Sture
Honda CX 500 (B) x 4.
Honda CB 400 N (C) Superdream -82. M´lady´s learner bike.
Yamaha SRX 600 -86. Project, currently in wait mode.
PAV 40, Czech single-wheel bike trailer. Project with many stand-stills.
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02-26-2009, 3:25 AM
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Reg in Bristol
Joined on 03-11-2006
Bristol UK
Posts 782
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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The part number of the Yamaha seal is
11H-12438-10
My local Honda dealer is also my local Yamaha dealer and
these were half the price of the Honda ones
The metal case is slightly larger than some original Honda ones
so if you do a full fit then you may have to lap the case out slightly
If you use the 'engine in ' method, it should be a one for one
The 'Mongrel' is on the road
78 frame, ZAB gubbins, 82 'TI' motor, Suzuki clocks, MZ screen
and gaiters, Kawasaki master cylinder, BMW horns
DIY wiring
and all thrown together with a fanatical inattention to detail :-)
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02-26-2009, 5:23 AM
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DAVID
Joined on 05-16-2007
FORNEY TX
Posts 937
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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Do a google search on the Yamaha part number 11h-12438-10-00. The cheapest place found is boats.net @ around $14.
82 GL500
81 KDX175
If all else fails, read the instructions
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02-26-2009, 8:25 AM
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Shep
Joined on 01-30-2007
UK.2x1980CX500A
Posts 7,647
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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02-26-2009, 9:47 PM
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dang84119
Joined on 02-22-2009
Herriman, UT
Posts 182
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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i have purchased the Yamaha one, does this make a difference in your method, due to the fact that it is slighltly larger, or something??
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
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02-26-2009, 10:21 PM
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dang84119
Joined on 02-22-2009
Herriman, UT
Posts 182
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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The rubber boot of the new one to be certain is just the rubber end period. Am
i right? Out of the cup leaving the spring working, just no rubber tip...
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
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02-26-2009, 11:40 PM
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dang84119
Joined on 02-22-2009
Herriman, UT
Posts 182
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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Oh well I just completly destroyed the new seal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Tried the heat the bottom like you said tried to pull, tried heat it came out so did spring torn to shit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!oH WELL TWENTY BUCKS GONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
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02-27-2009, 6:46 AM
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DAVID
Joined on 05-16-2007
FORNEY TX
Posts 937
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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The way I did one was to cut the metal cup and gently peel it away from the rubber, trimming the glue away as needed with a razor knife.
82 GL500
81 KDX175
If all else fails, read the instructions
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02-27-2009, 7:14 AM
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Shep
Joined on 01-30-2007
UK.2x1980CX500A
Posts 7,647
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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 dang84119 wrote: | | Oh well I just completly destroyed the new seal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Tried the heat the bottom like you said tried to pull, tried heat it came out so did spring torn to shit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!oH WELL TWENTY BUCKS GONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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As you have found out you have to be really gentle and play enough heat with a Cig lighter.Don't worry I SNAFUed one the 1st time I did it years ago 
Still cheaper and easier than using a Honda seal and getting the cup pressed in.Don't be deterred :)
My Music
http://www.reverbnation.com/pauldouglas/
Join Just In Case :)
http://globalcxglvtwins.hostingdelivered.com/
Id quot circumiret, circumveniat
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02-27-2009, 7:15 AM
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wildmanwill
Joined on 05-25-2008
Chester County, Pennsylvania
Posts 4,034
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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I pretty much just posted the same thing about five minutes ago in another thread he started. 
1983 CX650 Turbo
1982 CX500 Custom
Donating Member
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02-27-2009, 7:21 AM
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Shep
Joined on 01-30-2007
UK.2x1980CX500A
Posts 7,647
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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| wildmanwill wrote: | I pretty much just posted the same thing about five minutes ago in another thread he started.
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I noticed after I posted and can understand his anger and frustration but people just have to take their time and be gentle which I do state on my page.There's no harm in warming the mech seal up in a pan of boiling water to kelp soften the silicone gasket sealer they use to glue the seal in before using a Cig lighter to finish heating it and then very very gently pushing the innards out with the thumbs.
This method has saved countless tens if not hundreds of people having to either strip their bikes to replace the seal or getting a new metal cup pressed in which has it's own more serious consequences if it goes wrong!
My Music
http://www.reverbnation.com/pauldouglas/
Join Just In Case :)
http://globalcxglvtwins.hostingdelivered.com/
Id quot circumiret, circumveniat
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02-27-2009, 7:35 AM
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mildhog
Joined on 11-21-2007
Chesapeake, VA
Posts 856
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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I lightly used a propane torch on the two I replaced with no problems. Only need to apply the heat for a few seconds. I kept the cup in the cover since it was in good shape. Saw no need to replace and take a chance on screwing something up.
Arnie in VA
1980 GL1100I Goldwing
1982 GL500I Silverwing
1983 GL650
(The stable is full)
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02-27-2009, 7:35 AM
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Randall-in-Mpls
Joined on 07-06-2007
Minneapolis, MN
Posts 2,629
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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Try a propane torch with a very low flame. It really should take no effort to remove the seal from the cup, once the adhesive has softened.
R
'78 CX500 - Black Maggot --> Green Grub / Yellow Grub / Red Grub ???
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02-27-2009, 10:37 AM
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dang84119
Joined on 02-22-2009
Herriman, UT
Posts 182
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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I went got another seal boiled it for a few minutes, applied heat from a propane torch for a few seconds WILL NOT BUDGE AT ALL! I think if I keep trying I will melt the seal and ruin this one as well!! I can smell a little rubber burning. THIS IS NOT WORKING!!
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
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02-27-2009, 10:45 AM
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Randall-in-Mpls
Joined on 07-06-2007
Minneapolis, MN
Posts 2,629
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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Where are you applying the heat?
And where are you? If you're near Minneapolis, I'll do it for you.
R
'78 CX500 - Black Maggot --> Green Grub / Yellow Grub / Red Grub ???
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02-27-2009, 10:52 AM
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dang84119
Joined on 02-22-2009
Herriman, UT
Posts 182
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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Applying the heat on the bottom only with the torch low. I'm in Utah
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
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02-27-2009, 11:00 AM
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Randall-in-Mpls
Joined on 07-06-2007
Minneapolis, MN
Posts 2,629
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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| dang84119 wrote: | | Applying the heat on the bottom only with the torch low. I'm in Utah |
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I assume you mean the bottom of the metal cup.
Put a screwdriver under the spring, and pry lightly against the rim of the cup while applying heat to the bottom. I can't imagine the glue not releasing before the rubber burns. The spring and all the rest should come right out of the cup.
R
'78 CX500 - Black Maggot --> Green Grub / Yellow Grub / Red Grub ???
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02-27-2009, 11:07 AM
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dang84119
Joined on 02-22-2009
Herriman, UT
Posts 182
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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HELL YEA!!!!!!!!!!! RANDALL YOU DA MAN!!!
Tried with the torch on the bottom with the screwdrive prying and bang!! It's out THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
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03-24-2009, 10:05 AM
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ezzee
Joined on 08-20-2008
CT
Posts 858
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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Just checking on the correct Yahmah seal. There was a post listing 2 different Yah seals. This post lists 11H-12438-10-00, is this the best to use?
1978 CX 500
1981 GL 500
1981 Custom
1982 GL
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05-20-2009, 11:58 PM
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NateDawg
Joined on 10-15-2008
Oshkosh WI
Posts 491
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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| ezzee wrote: | | Just checking on the correct Yahmah seal. There was a post listing 2 different Yah seals. This post lists 11H-12438-10-00, is this the best to use? |
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What indicates that a mechanical seal is bad besides a physical examination? Leakage from the weep hole and anything else? And can anyone verify the cheapest place to get them? Is it "Davy" that Shep refer d to?
78' Standard Maggot
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05-22-2009, 9:22 PM
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TonyG
Joined on 04-05-2006
Central Pa
Posts 745
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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Sture, I read over the Aussie site about those davey seals.
Do you still have the contact info from either the company or the person who sent them to you?
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05-23-2009, 12:49 AM
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Sture (in Sweden)
Joined on 03-13-2006
Lund, SWEDEN, born -41
Posts 911
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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Tony,
I think it was a member of the Aussie CX group who bought a batch of these seals. I also think he had asked for pre-orders before from interested parties. The seals were later distributed. I believe the UK group bought one batch - a guy in France (I´m sending more details in an e-mail) also got quite some. I bought 10 from him. Still 6 or 7 left in a plastic bag in my garage for future needs.
I don´t know about whether there´ll be more orders on these or not. I´ll try to find more info.
Regards
Sture
Honda CX 500 (B) x 4.
Honda CB 400 N (C) Superdream -82. M´lady´s learner bike.
Yamaha SRX 600 -86. Project, currently in wait mode.
PAV 40, Czech single-wheel bike trailer. Project with many stand-stills.
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05-23-2009, 6:17 AM
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jhovel
Joined on 01-02-2008
Near Bendigo, Australia
Posts 69
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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I have 4 of these seals left for sale - and can get more if needed. I've been buying them in lots of 30 (twice in the past 12 months).
Current price is US$9.75 plus postage (not expensive, since they only weigh a couple of ounces even with the package).
Let me know if someone in the US wants to be a reseller or re-distributor to save some postage. You could then defray the postage over -say - 20 of them.
Cheers,
Joe
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05-23-2009, 8:43 AM
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TonyG
Joined on 04-05-2006
Central Pa
Posts 745
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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Sture and jhovel; thanks for the replies.
While I have your attention Sture: is the old bb and discussions archived anywhere? Or did it get lost to cyberland?
Phil, Here's another project.
How much is the Yamaha seal from the dealers?
Is this "Davey" seal a better fit?
Is there any report of them not working or needing special sealant or gasket material?
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05-23-2009, 12:01 PM
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Sture (in Sweden)
Joined on 03-13-2006
Lund, SWEDEN, born -41
Posts 911
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Re: WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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About the old BB:
I think Orvar (the webmaster of the previous Swedish CX-Club site) archived the total contents as the site was shut down.
How he has done since is more than I know - it´s not telling too much to say that he and the Swedish CX Club board had different opinions about many things. The site was a private enterprise by Orvar, done for free. Unfortunately he got very little appreciation from the club and there was no interest to take over when he had to shut it down (retired from his job, where he hosted the CX-site).
The present Swedish CX-site is not much in comparison. Still no ambitions to have a Bulletin Board. That sucks!
I´m still a member of the Swedish CX Club but have no ambitions to be involved or participate in their activities. So can´t tell much.
There were some prerequisites about data base programs, or something, with the old Swedish BB. Not easily converted to another format, if I got things right.
I can contact Orvar, if you wish.
About the seals:
I´ve had at least 4 Yamaha seals and three Davey ones pressed in on bikes, belonging to me and fellow Club members. They function perfectly, all of them, as far as I know. I have three Daveys in, myself. Seems they´re pretty identical to the Yamaha seal - I took a vernier caliper and compared - every important measure was identical between them. The Davey has no blue sealant ribbon on the outside of the metal cup. We put on blue Hylomar on the last one, but not on the earlier ones.
As far as I can tell there must have been the larger seal aperture in all the engines I´ve had to deal with. Not one had to be reamed up to accept the seal (proper / modified version of the Honda tool was used in a hydraulic press at "my" Honda shop).
Sture
Honda CX 500 (B) x 4.
Honda CB 400 N (C) Superdream -82. M´lady´s learner bike.
Yamaha SRX 600 -86. Project, currently in wait mode.
PAV 40, Czech single-wheel bike trailer. Project with many stand-stills.
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Honda CX500 & G... » CX500 GL500 Tra... » Technical Help ... » WHERE TO FIND CHEAPER MECANICAL SEAL
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